Home » R/E/P » j. hall » IMP17 Beat J.Hall Discussion
| Re: IMP17 Beat J.Hall Discussion [message #331623 is a reply to message #331621 ] |
Tue, 08 April 2008 10:51   |
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 imdrecordings
Messages: 86
Registered: September 2007
Location: Salt Lake City |
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I'm not proposing that this become a pissing match, Jason. Sorry. I'm just saying. 
On the flip side, Jason.
What was your idea for the song? Where did you hear this song coming from or going? What did you hear the song trying to convey to the listener and how did that affect the way you mixed?
I'm curious to know how everyone approached the mix! 
Scott Selfridge
PC:Mobo-Gigabyte GA-P35-DS3L (rev. 2.0)BIOS(F3), Graphics-Gigabyte GeForce GV-NX736256D-RH,RAM/MEMORY-Corsair DDRII 3x1gb, HD-System WD Raptor 75gb 10,000rpm SATA/AudioDrive Seagate Barracuda 350gb 7,200rpm SATA/BackupDrive Samsung 750gb 7,200rpm SATA, DVD_RW DRIVE-HP Lightscribe SATA, Audio Card- RME HDSP9652 PCI card DSP Processors-UAD-1e x 2 (in the PC case)
Software: Samplitude V10.1 Pro (SAM Settings *working* - Track FX Monitoring-ASIO Buffer 1024 -VIP Object Buffer 2048 -*Performance* Dual CPU & ASIO performance checked-HD/Scrub Buffer 1000 - Test Buffer 8000-Buffer Number 4 - Tracks Speed & Preload file cache on stop both Activated - Plug-in Buffer set to Best Performance ), Cubase4, Beer of choice: IPA
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| Re: IMP17 Beat J.Hall Discussion [message #331638 is a reply to message #331375 ] |
Tue, 08 April 2008 11:46 |
iCombs
Messages: 391
Registered: March 2006
Location: Minneapollis |
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I kept meaning to mention that somewhere...it took me about 3 or 4 listens...but that "will you put this body in floorboards just to hear m heart beating?" hit me and I went..."AHHHHHHHH...creepy!"
Ian Combs
Producer/Engineer
Lightspeed Group, Inc.
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"Mista apareeatah... can I have maar beass at all frequencies?"
----------------------
I'm utterly baffled at the general opinion regarding smoking. I don't smoke, but it's a bar, for God's sake. That's what your supposed to expect. It's a den of iniquity where people are going to indulge in all of the minor vices and sins denied to them during their mundane workdays. You can wreck your liver, ruin your hearing, get into a fight, and pick up an STD, but somehow smoking is unacceptable? Sheesh. We've turned into a nation of entitled whiners.
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| Re: IMP17 Beat J.Hall Discussion [message #331643 is a reply to message #331618 ] |
Tue, 08 April 2008 12:02 |
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j.hall
Messages: 3217
Registered: April 2004
Location: KC |
Platinum Member |
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| J-Texas wrote on Tue, 08 April 2008 10:34 |
As far as the darkness. Well, I was mixing this for mastering guys to hear. I thought that was the point. When I added about a 5db high shelf about 3500, it really sizzled without anything poking out too much. If you like the mix, check it out like that and see what you think.
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first off, if i were trying to beat my mix, the very first thing i would do would be to get the top end opened up and feeling good.
PLEASE don't read this as condescending or rude, but, i do about 40 - 60 projects a year. i hear my work mastered ALL THE TIME. so mixing something specifically for mastering in my case is a fairly solid educated guess of what i'll get on the back side.
i would never, NEVER recommend mixing "for mastering". and to be clear, i actually don't ever mix for mastering. this is my band, and i have complete control (minus what the other 3 guys want done). i mixed this record dark on purpose and for a specific goal.
it's too dark, no question. the mastered finished album is exactly what we wanted as a band, so it worked out.
also, i've never compared the output of my limiter to the source. to my ears, it's really transparent, but maybe it's boosting some highs.....i don't know, sorry about the "bait and switch" wasn't my intention at all.
j.hall
Theta Rhythm
"You have a great ear for vibe and feel and space. I'm not looking for any of that right now."
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| Re: IMP17 Beat J.Hall Discussion [message #331646 is a reply to message #331375 ] |
Tue, 08 April 2008 12:06 |
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imdrecordings
Messages: 86
Registered: September 2007
Location: Salt Lake City |
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J.
How did you use/mix the Room Mics for the drums?
I couldn't find a use for them.
Scott Selfridge
PC:Mobo-Gigabyte GA-P35-DS3L (rev. 2.0)BIOS(F3), Graphics-Gigabyte GeForce GV-NX736256D-RH,RAM/MEMORY-Corsair DDRII 3x1gb, HD-System WD Raptor 75gb 10,000rpm SATA/AudioDrive Seagate Barracuda 350gb 7,200rpm SATA/BackupDrive Samsung 750gb 7,200rpm SATA, DVD_RW DRIVE-HP Lightscribe SATA, Audio Card- RME HDSP9652 PCI card DSP Processors-UAD-1e x 2 (in the PC case)
Software: Samplitude V10.1 Pro (SAM Settings *working* - Track FX Monitoring-ASIO Buffer 1024 -VIP Object Buffer 2048 -*Performance* Dual CPU & ASIO performance checked-HD/Scrub Buffer 1000 - Test Buffer 8000-Buffer Number 4 - Tracks Speed & Preload file cache on stop both Activated - Plug-in Buffer set to Best Performance ), Cubase4, Beer of choice: IPA
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| Re: IMP17 Beat J.Hall Discussion [message #331658 is a reply to message #331375 ] |
Tue, 08 April 2008 12:33 |
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bblackwood
Messages: 5606
Registered: April 2004
Location: The home of Rock-n-Roll..... |
Platinum Member |
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Hey J, if this isn't the right place for this, feel free to move it...
Here are the notes I jotted down regarding each mix:
j.hall - nice bottom, gtrs seem smeary, overall dark
rkoehler - choruses smaller than verses and too dark, cymbals really eating up space
firefly - stereo spreader or verb? big smeary mess here
antman - vox too spitty/sibilant, guitars too scooped/neutered. where's the bottom?
billbehadaz - vox buried in chorus, vocal delay sounds cheap, too much dynamic shift from first chorus to last, will make the front of the song sound weak comapred to others around it. last chorus sounds good.
cymatics - strange buss compression, upper mids/top harsh, lower mids neutered
scott selfridge - bottom end nice, top a little edgy
grant richards - dark, nice pumping overall, sorta welrdly pushed in the mids
gregthompson - harsh upper mids, makes it seem overly-thin
jtexas - extremely dark and bottom heavy - tweeters 6dB to bright?
podgorny - nice presence, not over-done,but seems phasey
uncleozzy - snare way too big, overall dark tones
adammiller - nice balance.i like this one
ator - holy midrange batman!
boedconstrictor - vox too sibilant in verses, vocals distracting, overall balance prettty good
maxim - vox way too loud, mix very dark, little presence in choruses
icombs - very wierd spectrum - monitoring must be screwed in this room. no midrange!
robdarling - vox too loud, nice balance overall, maybe a touch splashy
Since this portion of IMP17 was to "beat J.Hall's mix", I'm considering his mix the benchmark. That being said, I only found one track that I would choose over J.hall's mix if I were mastering it and that was Adam Miller's. I think this mix is really well balanced and also has the smooth upper midrange and top end I look for in a good mix.
For comparison, here's j.hall's mastered mix (the way he wanted when he came down for mastering): *click*.
Here's Adam Miller's version mastered (though Adam's was mastered off the MP3: *click*.
Cheers, hope this helps!
Brad Blackwood
euphonic masters
"Enjoy sound." - Greg Calbi
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| Re: IMP17 Beat J.Hall Discussion [message #331699 is a reply to message #331636 ] |
Tue, 08 April 2008 15:30 |
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imdrecordings
Messages: 86
Registered: September 2007
Location: Salt Lake City |
Member |
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| j.hall wrote on Tue, 08 April 2008 11:42 |
| imdrecordings wrote on Tue, 08 April 2008 10:51 |
I'm curious to know how everyone approached the mix!
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two and a half minutes of teeth kicking rock.
i wanted my mix to be thick, wide and loud. i also wanted it to be fairly raw. i wanted the listener to feel slightly uncomfortable with the message that's being yelled at them.
the verse drum and bass groove just pounds itself out, and i'm always trying to make my rhythm sections slam.
my overall goal, was to have a mix that didn't get in the way of people hearing a rock band, being a rock band, while making the rock band sound larger then life.......
lyrically the song is about a single person seeking redemption. it's a metaphor based off Edgar Allen Poe's Tell Tale Heart
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That's pretty much what I heard and was going for, too. It's funny how people's tastes differ. It's so cool how the same idea from 2 different people yields two seperate results. I love mixing...
J.- 414's on the Rooms?
I don't mix any where near the amount of material you do.
That said...
When you mixed your own album, were there any albums/bands you kept in the back of your mind? Or do you approach a mix with the intent of exposing a feeling inside or vision and work at it until it finally becomes/is that? Does that make sense? 
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scott selfridge - bottom end nice, top a little edgy
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Brad,
Thank you! 
This place is great.
I love the feadback!
Scott Selfridge
PC:Mobo-Gigabyte GA-P35-DS3L (rev. 2.0)BIOS(F3), Graphics-Gigabyte GeForce GV-NX736256D-RH,RAM/MEMORY-Corsair DDRII 3x1gb, HD-System WD Raptor 75gb 10,000rpm SATA/AudioDrive Seagate Barracuda 350gb 7,200rpm SATA/BackupDrive Samsung 750gb 7,200rpm SATA, DVD_RW DRIVE-HP Lightscribe SATA, Audio Card- RME HDSP9652 PCI card DSP Processors-UAD-1e x 2 (in the PC case)
Software: Samplitude V10.1 Pro (SAM Settings *working* - Track FX Monitoring-ASIO Buffer 1024 -VIP Object Buffer 2048 -*Performance* Dual CPU & ASIO performance checked-HD/Scrub Buffer 1000 - Test Buffer 8000-Buffer Number 4 - Tracks Speed & Preload file cache on stop both Activated - Plug-in Buffer set to Best Performance ), Cubase4, Beer of choice: IPA
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| Re: IMP17 Beat J.Hall Discussion [message #331736 is a reply to message #331658 ] |
Tue, 08 April 2008 18:30 |
iCombs
Messages: 391
Registered: March 2006
Location: Minneapollis |
Active Member |
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| bblackwood wrote on Tue, 08 April 2008 12:33 |
Hey J, if this isn't the right place for this, feel free to move it...
Here are the notes I jotted down regarding each mix:
icombs - very wierd spectrum - monitoring must be screwed in this room. no midrange!
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That was a bit of an intentional choice...I really wanted the size top to bottom to feel a bit exaggerated. I think I just lost my frame of reference towards the end of it and scooped a little more than I should have. I know my room isn't stellar...but it's not THAT bad. 
Ian Combs
Producer/Engineer
Lightspeed Group, Inc.
----------------------
"Mista apareeatah... can I have maar beass at all frequencies?"
----------------------
I'm utterly baffled at the general opinion regarding smoking. I don't smoke, but it's a bar, for God's sake. That's what your supposed to expect. It's a den of iniquity where people are going to indulge in all of the minor vices and sins denied to them during their mundane workdays. You can wreck your liver, ruin your hearing, get into a fight, and pick up an STD, but somehow smoking is unacceptable? Sheesh. We've turned into a nation of entitled whiners.
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| Re: IMP17 Beat J.Hall Discussion [message #331800 is a reply to message #331699 ] |
Tue, 08 April 2008 22:32 |
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j.hall
Messages: 3217
Registered: April 2004
Location: KC |
Platinum Member |
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| imdrecordings wrote on Tue, 08 April 2008 15:30 |
J.- 414's on the Rooms?
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nope, this record was made totally ghetto.
tracked in a basement to a PT M-powered rig with a random slew of cheap mics.
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When you mixed your own album, were there any albums/bands you kept in the back of your mind?
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nope, i never do
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Or do you approach a mix with the intent of exposing a feeling inside or vision and work at it until it finally becomes/is that? Does that make sense?
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that's a tough question to answer. i think the idealistic side of myself would like to think feelings can be conveyed with the proper mix. i do know, believe and understand that the emotional content is up the band.
i do generally have a clear vision of where i want to take a mix, and i'm typically working toward that very early on. sometimes it changes as the mix develops, but that is kinda rare.
you have to keep in mind that forcing your will onto a song is a really bad approach, IMO.
i think that's something that takes a lot of experience and good instincts to finely tune. and i'm not saying i have either. i'm still learning and have much to learn.....
i do however enjoy the digital domain. i'll fearlessly edit and mix songs knowing if the band hates it, i just change it to what they want.......no harm no foul
j.hall
Theta Rhythm
"You have a great ear for vibe and feel and space. I'm not looking for any of that right now."
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