| Telefunken AC 701 Tube Primer [message #32580] |
Tue, 07 December 2004 18:01  |
 |
Klaus Heyne Messages: 2027 Registered: April 2004 |
Platinum Member |
|
|
The first chapter, below, is a slighly edited condensation of Oliver Archut's historical knowledge of the AC701.
"In the beginning Telefunken had two different AC701 versions, both low noise but one with the K designation was a frame grid construction vs. a round grid for the none K. That means that the K stands for 'klingarm' (low microphonics) for the frame grid version. The AC701 without the k was made for the audio section in AEG-Telefunken handheld two way radios for the west German army as well as some other military equipment.
"Neumann only used AC701k tubes that were pre selected in Ulm at Telefunken's factory and then selected them again for random noise and microphonics, if they passed, it got the wrapper (with an internal ser.#) around it. The "k" versions that didn't make it at Telefunken became standard AC701.
"Since 1965 Telefunken only made frame grid AC701 so there was no need to specially mark them. But careful:Telefunken also sold RFT Neuhaus-made ones under the "Telefunken" name that can be quite noisy and more microphonic than the Tele-made ones. Those ones had a white dot vs. a red indicator dot (for identification of the anode/plate-filament)
"The AC701 works nearly with any gain and mostly for impedance conversion so distortion test is not an issue here. I never had any problems with high distortion AC701 tubes, mostly with noise in the first case, rather than microphonics.
"A noisy AC701 you can sometimes save via ionization discharge over a 50 Meg resistor, but you have to come up first with a 1KV power supply and then the chance is about 30% that it will work properly over a longer time. Also it is quite likely you may get shocked!
"You can see on the tube date code when the tube was made:
If you have U for Ulm and then two letters, sometimes with two numbers, it is made before 1965 if you have U and seven numbers then it was made after 1965.
"If you buy an AC701 make sure you get an original, still in its sealed box, because 95% of all AC701 tubes out there for sale are Neumann rejects. If the tubes are not in the sealed box, get a money back guarantee for at least a week before buying.
------------------------------------------------------------ ---------------------
To add to Oliver's primer, here is some empirical data, from my 20-year experience with the tube:
1. Two out of three non-Neumann select AC701s (non-k) are not usable in microphones: they will have steady-state white noise or irregular discharges, beyond an acceptable level for critical recording situations.
2. One out of three non-Neumann select k are unusable, for the same reason.
3. One in 10 Neumann-select (in Neumann-box, with Neumann serial number on paper band around tube) are unusable.
4. Never judge an AC701 before at least a 48hr. burn-in (i.e. the tube is installed in the mic for which it is intended, and voltage-adjusted to the proper operating voltages): One in three tubes which were fine within the first hour of testing will develop discharges later on, especially once the tube has reached its thermal stability ( thermal stability = operating temperature of the tube, once the tube's heat dissipation through the heat sinking around it has stabilized, and the tube and its surroundings won't get any hotter).
5. Unlike tubes which you plug in, you cannot easily and thoroughly test an AC701 for noise outside of the mic, for example, with a tube tester. This tube needs to be soldered into the mic for testing.
6. Unfortunately, you rarely will be able to return AC701 tubes once you have installed them because the seller cannot easily sell an AC701 to the next customer as new, because its filament wires have already been cut and twisted for installation. This is especially true for Neumann KM-series.
7. Please note that the AC 701 is very sensitive to oversupply of heater voltage and can easily self-destroy under those circumstances. Therefore, many dealers are reluctant to sell a tube worth several hundred dollars with a money-back warranty unless they have control over the installation and are satisfied that the customer's power supply was correctly adjusted before installation.
8. I adjust my AC701 buying prices to the rule of thumb explained above: I discount each tube price so that the percentage of failure per tube is built into the price. That way I don't need to bother with money-back warranties which few sellers will give me anyway.
Klaus Heyne
German Masterworks
www.GermanMasterworks.com
|
|
|
| Re: Telefunken AC 701 Tube Primer [message #32710 is a reply to message #32580 ] |
Wed, 08 December 2004 12:03   |
John Bordon Messages: 76 Registered: June 2004 |
Member |
|
|
Thanks Klaus and Oliver for the AC701 Primer!
Where did AKG C60 fall into the distribution of the AC701 tubes?
I have an AC 701 k in my C60 with a post-1965 date code U, then 7 digits. But a separate 3 digit serial number is also on top of the tube. Is the 3 digit added by AKG?
JP
Attachment: ac701k.jpg
(Size: 495.64KB, Downloaded 752 time(s))
John Bordon
Sound Sculpture USA
|
|
|
|
| Re: Telefunken AC 701 Tube Primer [message #77168 is a reply to message #32580 ] |
Tue, 12 July 2005 22:33   |
volki Messages: 233 Registered: June 2004 Location: Berlin, Germany |
Active Member |
|
|
Sometimes used AC701's pop up on ebay, which have twisted / cut legs and thus obviously have been unsoldered from mics.
Since installation of an AC701 requires much more effort than swapping out standard, socketed tubes, I figure that these tubes are not coming from studios which used to change tubes in their mics every year or so by default.
Obviously, the only reason to replace this tube in a mic would be that it actually went bad, no? So these used tubes for sale either must be noisy, have not enough gain, or even may be completely dead?
Agreed. Used AC701s offered on e-bay or elsewhere should only be bought with a money-back warranty.
K.H.
Volker Meitz
|
|
|
| Re: Telefunken AC 701 Tube Primer [message #114869 is a reply to message #77168 ] |
Sat, 17 December 2005 00:12   |
minn Messages: 4 Registered: December 2005 Location: Brooklyn, NY |
Welcome |
|
|
Hallo Klaus,
Is this real AC701K? I have never seen AC701 stamped like this....
Thank you.
TM
Attachment: ac701K_1.jpg
(Size: 34.87KB, Downloaded 840 time(s))
Takashi Miyahara
|
|
|
| Re: Telefunken AC 701 Tube Primer [message #114870 is a reply to message #114869 ] |
Sat, 17 December 2005 00:13   |
minn Messages: 4 Registered: December 2005 Location: Brooklyn, NY |
Welcome |
|
|
pic2...
Attachment: ac701K_2.jpg
(Size: 37.73KB, Downloaded 826 time(s))
Takashi Miyahara
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
| Re: Telefunken AC 701 Tube Primer [message #155479 is a reply to message #155312 ] |
Thu, 11 May 2006 17:01   |
 |
Klaus Heyne Messages: 2027 Registered: April 2004 |
Platinum Member |
|
|
The tube frome the e-bay auction looks very real to me.
(Note the brazen use of whole sentences from this thread in the seller's description, to bolster his chances and make him sound more authoritative.
Bad manners not to attribute the source!)
I have added another shot of this Neumann-selected AC701k, because the eBay pictures may disappear after the auction:
Klaus Heyne
German Masterworks
www.GermanMasterworks.com
|
|
|
|
| Re: Telefunken AC 701 Tube Primer [message #162098 is a reply to message #162053 ] |
Wed, 07 June 2006 13:03   |
 |
Klaus Heyne Messages: 2027 Registered: April 2004 |
Platinum Member |
|
|
Your two AC 701 look authentic.
The final length of the filament wires, at the time of installation, is determined by the location inside the specific mic:
You can cut a filament in a KM by about 10mm, but remember that you need plenty of length to position the wires AFTER they have been twisted, or curled (for heat sinking.)
No general length can be quoted for "M" mics, as they are all diffenent in physical layout.
In case of doubt, leave them uncut, or as long as possible.
Klaus Heyne
German Masterworks
www.GermanMasterworks.com
|
|
|
|
|
|